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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraceLikeRain View Post
    Rescues, trusted friends, shelter, euthanasia, donate to vet school, contact previous owners/breeder, craigslist, etc. There are numerous options. Animals live in the moment and while it may be sad for *us* to think of euthanasia, the animals do not know. If someone is on food stamps then a yummy last meal and a peaceful euthanasia is a heck of a lot better than suffering from an injury, disease, infection, etc. that the owner cannot afford to treat.
    "The average time a food stamp recipient stays on the program is 9 months." -http://www.fns.usda.gov/cga/FactSheets/SNAP.htm 2/16/12
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  2. #22
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    May. 21, 2008
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    How is this even a question? If you are receiving FOOD STAMPS you are saying to the government that you absolutely can not afford to feed yourself. If you can't afford to feed yourself, you sure as shit can't afford to support a giant, expensive luxury item.

    If you are at the point where you need food stamps, the horse should have gone a while ago. Yes, life changes suddenly. You should have an emergency fund. If you can't afford to save enough money for an emergency fund to support yourself for a few months, you can't afford to have a horse. If something happens, and you have to tap in to your emergency fund, then your luxury items (and I'm sorry, but horses are luxury items) need to go.


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  3. #23
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    It's a fair point, but I just don't think it's a sustainable arrangement for most people anyway. Like, let's say I have a mortgage of $1500/mo and I was making $3k. I was let go and live in at at will state. I'm not eligible for unemployment (UC), although I would give it a try anyway. I get another job pretty quickly but now make minimum wage or $8.80x40x4.3 = $1513.00/mo (gross, which is what's counted). Most likely I would receive $22.00 in food stamps.

    FYI:
    "Households may have $2,000 in countable resources, such as a bank account, or $3250 in countable resources if at least one person is age 60 or older, or is disabled. However, certain resources are NOT counted, such as a home and lot, the resources of people who receive Supplemental Security Income (SSI), the resources of people who receive Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF, formerly AFDC), and most retirement (pension) plans. " - http://www.fns.usda.gov/snap
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  4. #24
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    Sep. 7, 2004
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    Medford Oregon
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    Having a pet and being on foodstamps is not a horrible act. Geeze I get people abusing the system but I've had plenty of elderly folks I've known getting food stamps who had a dog or a cat. Food stamp allowances even let you buy petfood on your card. A horse is questionable yes but a dog or cat? I think it's a reasonable thing to have a pet and be on food stamps.


    8 members found this post helpful.

  5. #25
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    Here's one that got me called a Burner of Puppies, although no horses are part of this story Identifying details altered.

    A disabled veteran received $900/mo in disability assistance from the VA but because he was homeless he has no housing expenses. That made him over-income for food stamps, but since he was under the maximum income level he could get $14/mo. He was pretty confused how to eat out of the AM/PM for that amount, ergo the puppies comment. Which is the only thing about the story that's unusual. Most people were pretty apologetic just for walking through the door.

    I wish I knew what the answer was, but I don't. I just always tell people who are concerned about gov't assistance to read up on policy and if they don't like what they see, call your representatives. That's what they're there for.
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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkmoonlady View Post
    Food stamp allowances even let you buy petfood on your card.
    Who told you that?

    Not true. You cannot buy toothpaste or soap with your card. You cannot buy pet food.

    However, more communities have started up pet food banks and hay banks.

    Ok, just checked to be sure and this has not changed:
    http://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/retailers/eligible.htm
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  7. #27
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    Sep. 7, 2004
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    Medford Oregon
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    I don't know but here in Oregon I know people who buy petfood (canned) on foodstamps. I think possibly the reasoning is some people actually eat it? I've been in line with my neighbors at the store and they bought wet pet food in the can on their Oregon Trail cards. If it doesn't go through the clerk tells them and they have to pay for "non-food" items with cash, this didn't happen. I even asked my neighbor, she said she's never been asked about it. She's elderly with a small dog.



  8. #28
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    Was this the thread I explained about EBT cards? Anyways, if you receive cash benefits you can use your EBT card to buy whatever. They are not using EBT Food benefits to buy the pet food. They can even be receiving benefits on their card issued from a Disability branch which has different rules.

    Next time you are at the grocery store when you are prompted to select credit or debit, notice the other options. Usually it will have an EBT option (or Oregon Trail card option) and from there EBT Food or EBT Cash. That Cash option is what the clerk is most likely referring to, although he could have also been referring to literal $$.

    As often happens, your neighbors' situation may not be what you think. Oh, it's also possible it's entered wrong at the grocery store in their computer but that would be REALLY unusual. And probably ultimately a loss for the store, but that's an interesting question. Anyway, more likely that an eligible item hasn't been entered yet. FS eligible items usually display with an "F" next to them.

    ETA: you mention she's elderly which could be important. If she's issued benefits from an Aging and Disabilities Branch or eg there is actually a weird exception which makes those, yes food, benefits function more like Cash. I dunno why but rest assured some policy makers somewhere wasted days of their lives bickering about it.
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    3 members found this post helpful.

  9. #29
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    Aug. 12, 2010
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    IMO, it really depends on the circumstances. If it is someone who had the horse(s) and could afford them and then fell on hard times and has to, temporarily, get food/fuel/whatever assistance until they can get back on their feet, I don't see a problem with that. You can't just dispose of a large animal at the drop of a hat, particularly in this economy.

    If it looks like the financial problems and need for assistance are going to continue indefinitely, it probably is time to start cutting discretionary spending for the long haul, including the horse(s).

    If someone is already unable to affford their life and THEN acquires a horse despite that, that's wrong, for many reasons.

    Now, showing, under any of these scenarios, is not right, that is a huge unnecessary expense. Even if you were showing to try to sell the horse, it would be better to free lease or loan the horse to someone else and have them show it at their expense...if it's a nice enough horse for that, some horseless teenager out there would probably want to show it.


    7 members found this post helpful.

  10. #30
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    Mar. 4, 2004
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    Oxford, PA
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    People who own horses should not receive food stamps. I have 3 horses and it is sometimes a struggle. Some months I have to put my feed on my charge card because I don't have enough on my checking account to cover it. We don't buy new cars, go on vacation or spend money on frivilous things. Horses can be considered a luxury (remember Michele O was quoted as saying "Only the rich can afford horses") so in order to "afford" my luxury I do without alot of other things.
    I for one am tired of the whole entitlement issue. My husband and I have worked hard all of out lives to have what we have. With no help from anyone including parents. We are in our 50s and still find it hard to pay our bills some months. But we always do-on time too. I am sick of standing behind someone in line at the grocery store who is chatting on their expensive Smartphone, buying steak with food stamps that I can't afford, then getting cigarettes with the money they saved (because they used food stamps to buy the actual food) and THEN getting into a Mercedes I could never afford. This is where my taxes are going? Mini-rant over.
    "You post all your drama on Facebook and get mad when people judge you? You're a special kind of stupid, aren't you?"


    3 members found this post helpful.

  11. #31
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    Sep. 24, 2003
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    I agree with all the posters who caution people not to rush to judgement. Every day, I see people who were doing just fine even with a relatively low-paying job, supporting their families and paying their bills, but not saving a whole lot--because raising a family on $20,000 is hard, and most of the people I see aren't making (after taxes) much more than that in the good times. But if they lose that job--or a crisis hits, like the mother I saw yesterday who had to pay to bury her 19 year old son--even with the cheapest possible options she'll be making payments for years, as well as exhausting her savings--they're in trouble fast. You can say, "Poor people shouldn't have cable," but in our town, you have to sign up for a year's worth of cable, you can't cancel it, and since the cable company and the electric company are one and the same, if you pay your electric bill but not your cable bill your electricity gets cut off.

    Yes, that's massively injust; we're fighting it, but the electric company doesn't seem to care.

    I see very very few people with true welfare checks anymore. TANF is rare, and when it does exist, the benefits are in the order of $250 per month.

    Food stamps will not pay for: diapers, shampoo, toilet paper, tampons. Let alone pet food.

    I don't think anyone should be showing horses while on government assistance. But if you have a horse out to pasture, you lose your job, you're getting food stamps for awhile while desperately searching for a new job--I wouldn't say you should put the horse down before I give you some food. There's such a thing as mercy.


    17 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
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    Aug. 1, 2002
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    Georgia
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    Just keep in mind that just because you see someone pull out an EBT card, does not always mean they are on food stamps. I get child support - when my Ex decides to pay - direct deposited to my state EPT card. I imagine it's the same card used for food stamps.

    As for "no one should have horses if on any type of Gov. Support"....,what about SS Survivor benefits? My two kids and I receive monthly payments, and I still own my two ponies. Is that wrong? Now of course the kids' money doesn't go to the horses, but mine does. My daughter is 22 months old, and until she goes to Pre-K, it just makes more sense to stay home with her. I am smart about my horses, and I have some great deals - Chocomare trims them, I don't board them, I don't lesson or show.....


    4 members found this post helpful.

  13. #33
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    Feb. 14, 2012
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    Fern Creek, KY
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    I have a friend who has a 14 month old daughter whom she stays at home with. Her husband works for the goverment as an Army National Guard contractor. They have full Blue Cross/Blue Shield health benefits, and get paid about $400 less a month than DH and I do. They live in section 8 housing (so all bills are taken care of in their rent) with a generous allowence for WIC and food stamps/EBT. Somehow they never seem to have any money (and were coming to DH and I often asking for money for gas, food, etc.). They have been living this way for almost 2 years now. Yet they are attempting to conceive another child.

    I don't understand WHY you would want to bring another child into this world, when you are begging friends for money at 9pm because you can't afford dinner for your current child? It blows my mind. I understand that sometimes accidents happen, the best accident that ever happened to me is sitting on my lap, but to be actively TRYING... smh.

    I also feel very, VERY strongly that people who apply and are accepted into those kinds of programs be requird to take a few classes on finance and budgeting. DH and I live comfortably, in a nice home with nice things, I have a horse and we are looking to aquire one for him. We drive nice cars, and we have a very cushy savings account for emergencies. I'm grateful that we have all these things, but it's because we know how to manage our money.

    I understand that people fall on hard times, I lived in my car for two months in my late teens because I couldn't afford a place even though I had a full time job! Once I learned how to budget, and got a second job working nights, I was fine and learned a valuable lesson. I don't think my friend is learning anything.

    And what REALLY grinds my gears is when I worked nights, people would come in, use their EBT cards in the ATM (idk if you can still do that) and then buy their cigrettes... but don't get me going on that...
    Quote Originally Posted by MistyBlue View Post
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    3 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    Aug. 23, 2006
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    SSI is totally different than food stamps. SSI is insurance that we all pay for through our jobs. No one should begrudge anyone collecting those benefits after a parent or spouse has died. And you don't have to "qualify" (asset-wise) to receive SSI benefits. They are meant to help support children and/or spouses.

    Food stamps are meant to be a temporary means of sustaining people who cannot afford to feed themselves. If someone has such a limited availability of money the reason for that lack of money should definitely be examined by those in charge of qualifying someone for food stamps!

    If you have "X" dollars and pay for housing, electricity, heat, and other necessities for life and then haven't got enough left to pay for food, I don't think receiving food stamps would be viewed negatively. BUT, if there is money left and the person chooses to use it to pay for a luxury such as a horse, or horses, or an expensive car, horse shows, dog shows, or whatever - well that is just plain wrong. Why should we, the taxpayers, pay for their "wants" (a totally different thing than their "needs")?

    Unfortunately the *system* obviously isn't currently geared toward catching this type of fraud and until it is tightened up I guess these "cheaters" will continue to abuse the system *because they can*!

    I like to think that the majority of people are honest and I don't have a problem helping anyone who is truly in need.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
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    HillnDale, I think your posts on this thread have been the most informative I've ever read on this subject, and I've seen this exact debate lots of times on different boards over the years.
    "smile a lot can let us ride happy,it is good thing"

    My CANTER blog.


    9 members found this post helpful.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkmoonlady View Post
    Having a pet and being on foodstamps is not a horrible act. Geeze I get people abusing the system but I've had plenty of elderly folks I've known getting food stamps who had a dog or a cat. Food stamp allowances even let you buy petfood on your card. A horse is questionable yes but a dog or cat? I think it's a reasonable thing to have a pet and be on food stamps.
    I live in an apartment. A dog or cat would cost me for the animal's food, and if I was poor enough I would likely not take it for routine vet visits, and hope it didn't need any emergency ones.

    A horse, hereabouts, would also cost me rent (board). Rough board is at least $250 here, more likely $300 now with winter coming. That's not counting grain which my mare, at 22, does need now, or farrier which can't really be suspended like a dog's annual wellness check.
    That's a large chunk of money to be paying month in, month out for someone who can't afford to feed themselves.

    Now, an airfern that can be thrown onto the "back 40" for next to no money, or if you own our own pasture, I guess that's more like the housepet situation.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  17. #37
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    To be honest, I try not to judge. I know some people with horses that have fallen on some really hard times -- unexpected job loss, medical bills that wipe out savings -- and have horses. Mostly old horses that are completely unmarketable -- the other alternative is the grave. A little support while they get back on their feet and find a new job does not bother me at all. If there is a horsey medical event they would have to put them down, but I see no reason why they should have to preemptively shoot the old horses because the job hunt is taking a few months. The economy sucks.

    Abusers of the system -- not fond of that. People who go out and BUY a horse while on food stamps -- that's awful. But blanket statements like "no one should ever get food stamps if they own a horse" don't work. Life is not so neat most of the time.


    14 members found this post helpful.

  18. #38
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    Time to grow up S&S. If you are taking government assistance, unless your horse is putting funds into the program, no, you have no right. Do you consider your horse as important as someone else feeding a child? If we had a true jobs creation program, not a make work program but real productive jobs, we would not be having a rather lopsided discussion about this. People cheating, forcing people to take contraceptives to prevent child birth while on food stamps but being able to have horses? It is very hard to look at this from a simplistic standpoint but morally, really, because you gave your horse a promise?
    "I have brought on the hatred of Wall Street and I relish it".
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    4 members found this post helpful.

  19. #39
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    Nov. 12, 2009
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    New England
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    And then you have crap like this happening:http://www.wcax.com/story/17005917/a...lic-assistance

    When there is someone who really needs the "system" and can't qualify for it, this just takes the cake. Yes, I have made my disgust very clear along with letters and phone calls to my local representatives. I have also asked "how do we fix this?". Still waiting for a response.



  20. #40
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    Oct. 14, 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Perfect Pony View Post
    So what happens to all the animals? Yes, ALL animals are a luxury, but what about horse/pet owners who suddenly find themselves in a financial bind and have pets. Do they take the dogs and cats to the shelter and have them put to sleep? And not every horse owner has some fancy horse in a fancy barn that would be easy to sell or re-home. Millions of pets and thousands of horses are killed and slaughtered every year as it is already. There are not enough homes.

    With millions of people suffering economically, should we go police what pets they have, then kill them?

    Sometimes you really need to think things through a little.
    Dogs and cats eat for a relatively small amount of money. Horses are pretty expensive to feed and live 2-3X longer than small pets. I have no problem at all with someone loading up a stock trailer and taking their horse(s) to New Holland or giving them away via Craigslist before they qualify food stamps or government assistance. You might have a problem with slaughter, I don't.

    I can see keeping a dog or cat that they had prior to going on assistance. However, if they have several pets, or large pets that cost a considerable amount to feed (i.e. 3 St. Bernards vs 3 chihuahuas) they probably need to reconsider if they can afford to keep their pets.


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