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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by FatPalomino View Post

    Has anyone had FEMA show up yet? From what I have heard, it's no, at least not in the Jersey Shore.
    Here's one COTHer who has reported FEMA on the Jersey shore.

    http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...ma#post6649883

    the town is getting a lot of Attention from FEMA so things are improving daily.
    Heard someone on the radio yesterday talking about priorities during the recovery... focusing on infrastructure, identifying housing for displaced people, delivering fuel for emergency vehicles, etc. I did see a reference somewhere - maybe not on COTH - to FEMA inspecting individual houses but I'd think that wouldn't be at the top of the list in the hardest hit areas.

    In California we are warned repeatedly to prepare to care for ourselves and our neighbors for at least the first week if not longer after a major earthquake. When the infrastructure is widely disrupted it is simply not physically possible to have aid everywhere immediately.


    5 members found this post helpful.

  2. #22
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    [QUOTE=LauraKY;6650113]You really ought to fact check this stuff before you repeat it.
    http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Non-Union-Utility-Crews-from-Alabama-Turned-Away-From-Helping-NJ-Sandy-Victims-176949061.html


    And again, easily verifiable if you actually know what you are talking about. Even Snopes, ran by some very active Dem supporters, says that they were presented with paperwork to conform to the union LOL!!

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sandyunion.asp

    If you follow the news story time line it goes from the reports of the union saying they wouldn't let them in, to making them sign union papers to become an affiliate, to the union blustering away that "no one" was turned back and they don't have to sign papers to then Christie declaring it "never happened". Umm, of course the unions and then Christie aren;t going to want to look bad and backpeddle LOL!! But, the actions happened and are traceable through various new sources.
    The Knotted Pony

    Proud and upstanding member of the Snort and Blow Clique.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  3. #23
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    Apr. 17, 2002
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    Why weren't you there for your Dad, FP? If you expect so little from FEMA why didn't you fly home earlier? It seems you left him to fend for himself in the face of a deadly storm.


    7 members found this post helpful.

  4. #24
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    "I saw a story on the news this morning where the Anheuser Busch had switched one of their beer production lines to produce cans of water to be shipped for free to the disaster areas. The switchover took them less than a day. Private industries are just more flexible and able to respond in situations such as this. "


    Absolutely true. I think in many cases (mostly for minor to medium issues) that people or private industry can help each other sooner than the government can.

    Just look at how bad the gas situation is in parts of the state. The rationing isn't working. In some counties, very few gas stations are open and it's a crapshoot whether or not they have gas on any given day. So if your number comes up, say if you have an even numbered license plate and it's an even numbered day, AND you can find gas, then great. If you can't find gas then you have to wait another ~2 days before you can try again. Meanwhile you have to find a way to get to work and you hope, as someone pointed out earlier that you don't "run out of gas trying to find gas".

    Governor Christie made a big deal about how the rationing is supposed to ease the lines at the pump, but I don't see that happening at least in my area. IMO a lot of people I know are doing better by carpooling to where they need to go instead of waiting for the government to put measures in place to "ease the problems".


    1 members found this post helpful.

  5. #25
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    Where humidity isn't just a word, it's a way of life.
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    [QUOTE=twotrudoc;6650186]
    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    You really ought to fact check this stuff before you repeat it.
    http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Non-Union-Utility-Crews-from-Alabama-Turned-Away-From-Helping-NJ-Sandy-Victims-176949061.html


    And again, easily verifiable if you actually know what you are talking about. Even Snopes, ran by some very active Dem supporters, says that they were presented with paperwork to conform to the union LOL!!

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sandyunion.asp
    If you follow the news story time line it goes from the reports of the union saying they wouldn't let them in, to making them sign union papers to become an affiliate, to the union blustering away that "no one" was turned back and they don't have to sign papers to then Christie declaring it "never happened". Umm, of course the unions and then Christie aren;t going to want to look bad and backpeddle LOL!! But, the actions happened and are traceable through various new sources.
    Snopes claims the story is a mix of "false" and "undetermined" (as in has not been verified as true or not true).
    How is that "verified"?


    1 members found this post helpful.

  6. #26
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    One thing I learned from living in California, similar to what RainyDayRide had to say is being prepared for a disaster. In Cali it was all about earthquakes, however similar things apply with respect to the hurricane aftermath on the east coast.

    1) Always have a weeks worth of potable water on hand.
    2) Have batteries, flashlights, candles and matches available.
    3) Have enough canned goods(soup, vegetables), energy bars or other non-perishable items for several days worth of meals. Operate on the assumption that if there's a disaster, you might not have power or access to gas and won't be able to cook from a stove of any sort. The idea is to have at least a few days worth of food that you can eat that doesn't require cooking or refridgeration.
    4) Have a full tank of gas whenever possible. Don't drop below a 1/2 tank if you can possibly help it.
    5) Have a 3 day emergency kit or grab-and-go bag.

    Edit: one of the reasons I got in a habit of always having a week's worth of fresh water on hand is so that I never have to worry about the municipal water supply. I drink what I stockpiled the week before and ran through the water filter. If the water supply gets tainted for whatever reason, say a natural disaster or whatever, I don't have to worry about what I just drank.
    Last edited by SnicklefritzG; Nov. 4, 2012 at 10:45 PM.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  7. #27
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    Nov. 4, 2003
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    Sanger, TX, USA
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    Fema ran out of water Friday, put bids out for more and hope to receive by Monday.
    So much for the red tape being waived....there's undoubtedly a Walmart Distribution
    Center in the area and others a bit forward with a gazillion bottles of water or the
    ability to get them there quickly. Anhuser Busch is shutting down a beer line to bottle water. The military across the river at Ft. Dix has had MRE meals and water
    and helicopters ready to go but can't seem to get approval.

    Government can't do it: here's a link to a good piece about how private enterprise
    plays a big roll in disaster relief. Some might not like the politics included in it, so
    skip down about halfway where it starts talking about Fema's director Fugate and how they use the Waffle House Index to figure out the hardest hit areas, at least in the southeast. It also walks about the role Walmart, Home Depot, Lowe's etc. play.

    Also many of the large charities such as Salvation Army, Samitarians Purse, Baptist Ministries are set up to get trucks and supplies in quickly along with volunteers to help with the work. Mercury One, Glenn Beck's charity, was the first of anyone or anybody into the Coney Island area with two truckfuls and more came later. They relied on the local churches to distribute the supplies.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  8. #28
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    Nov. 4, 2003
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    Sanger, TX, USA
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    Sorry about that....didn't get to finish. Cat stepped on keyboard and all future
    typing was one word per line. Anyway, it sounds if Fema is at least thinking more about using all the resources available. In this event, it seems like they could do that and spend more of their own resources getting to the homeowners and helping find them places to live. The weather is cold and going to get worse...already one
    man has died from the cold.

    Have been to NY a couple of times and driven through a couple of times but not very familar with the area. Pulled up a google map of the area the other day and did not realize so many areas of the city are ocean front. Zooming in the areas and seeing thousands of home just off the beach.

    FP, glad you made it home. Can't read your PM from the other day....ads are covering most of it. Feel free to email...think my email address is in the profile.
    Hugs to your father!


    1 members found this post helpful.

  9. #29
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    The public would never be willing to pay the cost for enough supplies, equipment, and labor that's ready to be mobilized overnight or faster. The public is willing to play the odds game: that odds are a disaster will be rare enough that they won't have to worry about it, or do, and are willing to prepare themselves as best they can. The population of the U.S. is increasing exponentially, which means each new disaster will probably affect an unprecedented number of people.

    I expect that federal agencies have to coordinate with state and local agencies to exchange information and try to formulate the best response. This takes time, and it also takes time and money to put a communication and assessment plan in place that will work across agencies.

    FEMA employees are also people, and their work may also only be as good as the preparedness of individuals and local gov'ts.

    Because people wouldn't want to pay for a fleet of extra power linemen that just sit around until there's an emergency, there is going to be a delay in mobilizing.

    People need to plan for themselves, and not assume they will be rescued / taken care of timely. And this is not directed to the OP necessarily, but people also need to have realistic expectations, and maybe just be thankful there is a lineman out there working for 72 hours straight with no sleep to help them. And maybe the media could point this out more often, too, instead of zeroing in on the hysterics.
    Fear is the rocket sauce.
    Jack Black


    7 members found this post helpful.

  10. #30
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    Mean people really suck
    Last edited by FatPalomino; Nov. 6, 2012 at 06:10 PM.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  11. #31
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    Government- based aid will always be an ill fitting band aid. Demanding more of 'them' than we do of ourselves is a slippery first step away from self reliance.

    I do feel for city-bound victims of this storm, though. Living out in the country a bit, I think I'd expect to be way down the list of folks getting help- so we've got supplies on hand by default.
    Last edited by katarine; Nov. 5, 2012 at 10:25 AM.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  12. #32
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    Done
    Last edited by FatPalomino; Nov. 6, 2012 at 06:11 PM.



  13. #33
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    I have never thought of FEMA as a first responder. The initial recovery efforts have to be by those who are there. The individual, their neighbors, their local first responders, local government, state government and then national government. The larger the entity the slower it is get moving. People have to take personal responsibility and that includes helping each other (not preying on them) and getting a local government who has their best interests at heart.

    I'm reminded of Katrina and how you heard very little about Mississippians who were just as devastated as NO. That's because the poorest state in the union's own people stepped up to take care of their own. Those in the state who weren't as affected by the storm came to help those who were and kept coming. Also those in AL, GA, TN, FL and TX (though Tx mainly helped LA ) jumped into help.


    It seems like people just want to be taken care of by someone else . Maybe this country does really want Obama and the socialist ideas he represents.


    3 members found this post helpful.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by hastyreply View Post
    I have never thought of FEMA as a first responder.
    I wouldn't have, either. That's what his homeowner's has said, that FEMA will get there before their adjuster, and they literally said, wait for FEMA first.

    I wanted to share what some of the people in NJ were going through- the things you won't see on the news- to give a different perspective. Some of you are downright rude and nasty. Hopefully those of you that couldn't find a nice thing to say are also invincible from natural disasters. Like I said before, there's an outpouring of people there to help. Those volunteers and citizens can't declare a house inhabitable or repairable, however.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  15. #35
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    All anyone is saying is that he's not alone. There are hundreds of thousands of people in need. Hundreds of thousands.

    I don't know that we're rude and nasty so much as we're realistic. My state took in Katrina evacuees. We understand hurricanes. We understand tornadoes. Tuscaloosa is one hour from me through the woods. Are you aware of what happened there last April? My parent's house was spared, barely, years ago when a yard full of 100+ year old pines fell like kindling all over the yard. We get it. More than you know, we get it.

    We're not invincible- we're just suggesting that patience and a broadened perspective may help buy you a longer fuse.

    It's about to get worse before it gets better- y'all have bad weather coming. It really, really stinks for the entire region now- that is absolutely hard as Hell, we get that. And we give $ and donate and do what we can from afar. You've got power crews there from MS, AL and loads of other states doing all they can to help. It just takes time, and there's no magic bullet, period. I'm sorry, but that is just a fact.


    10 members found this post helpful.

  16. #36
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    Jun. 25, 2004
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    It is easier to armchair QB when you and your family are not affected. Not so when it is personal.

    I know what hurricanes can do, even 600 miles away from the coast. Have been through snow and ice storms in an area unused to such.

    You learn to stock up and take care of yourself because government will be late and tied up with procedures and unable to "this" because they can nay do "that". Another group will help you with"this". And everyone moves at their own snail's pace.
    This is what your father is dealing with FP. My condolences.

    DH and I took some folks over to MS the week after Katrina. The greatest presence was Salvation Army volunteers from South Carolina to Texas cooking and serving food in 90+ degree weather. Just to let ya'll know...these folks were mainly white serving in a largely black community.

    FEMA showed up, to try to take the bags of ice the Salvation Army was providing the community.

    The 2005 USEA annual meeting was scheduled for NO and had to be relocated to Charlotte, NC. Great for me because I could attend. One of the speakers was a vet who had assisted in multiple natural disasters for more than 10 years at that time. He was clear - you are on your own for at least 3-4 days, make preparations. Don't expect that anyone will be able to reach you quickly. Flooded areas, washed out roads/bridges, downed trees, etc.

    i hope things work out well for your family. Get ready to move slow, it is never quick in these types of situation.
    "Never do anything that you have to explain twice to the paramedics."
    Courtesy my cousin Tim


    4 members found this post helpful.

  17. #37
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    What Fooler and Katarine said.

    I grew up in NJ and still have family there and in CT. So far at least one of their houses has been declared uninhabitable. I was almost killed in a hurricane because my mom and her sister didn't take the evacuation orders seriously.

    You can't prep for everything, sometimes you just have to leave. OTOH if you are going to stay, have food and water and expect that it's NOT going to be fun. Some people are going to be helped before you. And hard as it is when everyone else has power, if you're at the end of the distribution line you're going to be way down on the list. It's going to take time
    I wasn't always a Smurf
    Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  18. #38
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    Honestly, FP, the next group you're going to be complaining about it your father's insurance company. They're telling you they can't do anything until FEMA gets there. It's the first way they're trying to dodge you're dad's claim. Ask me how I know.

    My dad lost his house in Isabel. The storm surge brought 7' of water into his home through the glass front of his house when it could no longer hold back the water and washed all of his belongings into the Chesapeake bay. He lost 3 cars as well. After the initial cleanup, his insurance company spent the good part of 9 months telling him that the wind from the hurricane had damaged the glass facade of his home, then the RAIN from the hurricane had caused the water damage, not the 7' of standing water. So they told him for 9 months that he did not have "hurricane insurance", and that the damage was not going to be covered under his flood insurance policy. He lawyered up and spent another 4 years fighting them. He ended up getting payouts via his flood insurance that included things like $25.00 to replace his $900.00 storm doors. He just finished rebuilding his house this summer (mostly out of pocket), and Isabel happened in 2003.

    His neighbor went through the same thing. He owns the marnia next door. During the hurricane as the storm surge came in, the roof blew off of a large indoor boat house. It completely flooded when the storm surge hit it. The insurance company told him it was hurricane damage and wouldn't be covered by flood insurance, as the roof had blown off from wind, and had exposed the building to rain. Nevermind the storm surge that came from below. Again, he spent years in court fighting his insurance company to get some form of payout.

    FEMA is not going to be the bully here. When I look at the number of people that have been affected by this hurricane who are likely "properly insured", it's going to be the insurance companies that are going to drag out paying the residents. People are going to be fighting for years to rebuild from this. It's heart wrenching to think how difficult this is going to be.
    Here today, gone tomorrow...


    3 members found this post helpful.

  19. #39
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    from a NZ perspective - we are just starting the re-building phase after 3 devasating earthquakes that have completely changed the face of one of our cities Christchurch - so much so that Christchuch's iconic cathedral is coming down.

    We are told that we should be prepared to look after ourselves for 3-5 days post a major disaster. This by our Civil Defence (equivalent of FEMA). In the first few hours immediately after each earthquake, locals got stuck in and starting rescues - probably not well co-ordinated but they tried often under the direction of a single emergency services worker or none. A

    In the immediate aftermath, the "authorities" were focusing on getting some sort of handle on the big picture, getting rescue co-ordinated, making sure that at least one hospital was up and running, setting up emergency housing (and a field hospital/first aid clearing post) checking on infrastructure and the like. Our Earthquake Commision - responsible for examining property after any major disaster didnt start visiting properties for 3 days.... and they still are!

    So the question is, what are you doing to help?

    To be frank, what gets people back up and running in these disasters is communities. In Christchurch, after each of the 3 worst e/qs, we had the "Farmy Army" - farmers, farm hands etc - coming in with tractors, diggers, trucks, strong backs and legs to help move silt etc. We also had the "Student Army" - similar to the "Farmy Army" but generally providing the strong backs . These were spontaneous - and came from all over the country.
    Still Working_on_it - one day I will get it!



  20. #40
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    The Governor just announced that several more FEMA mobile units have been added on the CT coast and is urging everyone affected to get registered now. If the phone number doesn't work, the website is www.disasterassistance.gov.

    We are down to 25,000 people without power, and the weather forecast for the Nor'easter now calls for 70 mph winds on the coast, 50 mph winds inland, and 6 inches of snow in the northeast hills of the state, with this thing beginning as pellets of ice. Meaning that some people who just got power, or will get it by Wednesday afternoon, will be out again by Wednesday night. Just what we all needed.

    ETA: 8 trucks and crews from Yankee Gas (CT) are leaving for NJ for a 2 week stay to help out; NStar Gas from Massachusetts is also sending crews down tonight.
    "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." Albert Einstein

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